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Oct 26, 2015
Icon_missing_medium robb01 31 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

One way to do this, and it depends on the application, is to keep the raw data at e.g. a frequency of one minute for a short period like a month, then to keep 5 minute data for three months and 30 minute data for 12 months. 

The aggregation tools can be setup with layers to do it like this but it also puts a cap on the total amount of data being stored.

Then the user can look at monthly figures over a one year period for a long term view and look at finer detail when necessary for the recent data.

 

 
Oct 26, 2015
Icon_missing_medium gdruce 16 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

Hi Sam

Raw data,  I'll cast a vote in for 1 month.

Aggregated / Summarised can I stretch the friendship and say forever ?

This would would work well for how I use energy data (kWh). 

Power data I'm less certain. Possible I could do without data older than 30 days at all.

temperature data, pref is forever at 30 min windows.

 
Oct 26, 2015
Samotage_300_medium samotage 555 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

Thanks @kkemp

My thoughts are:

1. An option to keep the amount of raw data

2. Another option to keep the amount of aggregated/summarised data.

Summarised data will of course be cheaper, as it has much less storage overhead.

I would be interested to see what people think are a fair and reasonable time frame for raw and aggregated data would be.

Sam, @samotage

 

 
Oct 26, 2015
Icon_missing_medium kkemp 12 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

I think you are looking at this feature completely wrong. This feature allows you to keep historic data vs just deleting it after 2 years. If you only keep 2 years I'll have to move to a system that can keep my historic data. If instead you charge per data point stored then eventually it'll cost too much and I'll move to a different system. Or if you do what you are doing now a new customer and a customer with 5 years of data cost you the same amount. So this feature improves your profit margins or allows you to charge less and retain more customers. 

 
Oct 25, 2015
Samotage_300_medium samotage 555 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

I have looked at rrdtool - and many others, and it sucks.  Period.

SEG could not do what it does if that was the underlying architecture!

 
Oct 25, 2015
Icon_missing_medium robb01 31 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

My understanding is that you can run the analytics and graphics on the rrdtool data. The rrdtool is interposed between the incoing data and the analytics. Just a suggestion, but there may well be better tools or techniques.

 
Oct 25, 2015
Samotage_300_medium samotage 555 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

@Dargs you got it right for some of the older v1 SEGmeters!

@robb01 lols rrdtool... Perhaps the ugliest most useless tool for data storage IMHO... Can't run analytics on it and it's file based - I think the '90's just called and wants it's rrdtool back!  

@kkemp I think this could make sense, having a setting that allows people to select the raw and aggregate retention.  I'm not going to be deleting any data until I have this nailed.  FWIW - I have to go to some effort to implement this feature which will in effect reduce potential income... Do work to get paid less!  Must be a concept from some parallel universe.

Sam, @samotage

 
Oct 25, 2015
Icon_missing_medium robb01 31 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

kkemp said: Hopefully instead of deleting data you  spend time creating a feature that allows one to set retention periods and roll ups so they can keep their history but at more realistic intervals such as daily or even hourly. 

Hey Sam. Have you considered using rrdtool to achieve something like this? Its uses a data consolidation feature to set how much data is stored for different periods of time and thus limits the total amount of data stored.  Could be useful as a means of controlling the cost of storage. Maybe this could be a feature option depending on what pricing option the user wants to go for. I.e. limited data storage or unlimited.

 

 
Oct 25, 2015
Dargs_medium dargs001 44 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

Ah it seems its as easy as changing the Cycles, got it set to 60 now, and the data is sending through at about every 45 seconds.

 
Oct 25, 2015
Dargs_medium dargs001 44 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

Hey Sam, 

I'm happy to go to paid, been a good 4 years of not having to! 

I'm still running v0.18 on my segmeter v1, just trying see whats the best way to get the dataz sending above 40sec,  is it around here somewhere that I should add more averaging & cycles? 

 

 #define CHANNELS 3 // Current sensor(s) #define SAMPLES 1000 // 1000 Samples to take

#define AVERAGES 3 // 3 Number of RMS values to average

#define CYCLES 2 // 20 Number of times to cycle through the calculations

 

Thanks

dargs

 
Oct 23, 2015
Samotage_300_medium samotage 555 posts

Topic: Comments and Suggestions / Integration with Amazon Web Services (AWS) Internet of Things (IOT)

An interesting point on the Amazong IoT platform...

$5 per month per million messages.

Consider a 100 stream SEG setup, sending data every 10 seconds.  Assiming that each data point is a "message" in Amazon speak that is:

10 seconds, gives 6 messages per minute, 360 per hour, 8640 per day. 

At 100 streams, 864,000 messages per day.

26,784,000 messages per month, ~$115 per month - with no visualisation, analytics or any of the other magic in SEG to make sense of it, and who knows what work is required to set it all up?

Just some random thoughts,

Sam, @samotage

 

 
Oct 23, 2015
Samotage_300_medium samotage 555 posts

Topic: Comments and Suggestions / Integration with Amazon Web Services (AWS) Internet of Things (IOT)

SEG has been doing stuff like this for ages, and is the whole Control application - which has been in alpha for some time now.

It's a great feature that allows inputs from devices and other things to run through decision trees and issue commands back to the device to do things like turn stuff on or off, adjust set points and a host of other things.

It's been tricky to make work robustly, but it's there and has been baked in from the start.

This is something on the roadmap after the paid service transition has completed.

Sam, @samotage

 
Oct 22, 2015
Icon_missing_medium gdruce 16 posts

Topic: Comments and Suggestions / Integration with Amazon Web Services (AWS) Internet of Things (IOT)

At the Amazon Summit the other week they annouced their Internet of Things Services that look at the capturing of data from devices, processing of that data against rules, capture and storage, and the triggering of actions back to devices.

It would be interesting to see if customers could take a larger responsibility for thier own footprint using SEGMeter technologies that integration with these services.

Ref: https://aws.amazon.com/iot/

 

 
Oct 22, 2015
Icon_missing_medium kkemp 12 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

Ah, excellent. The pricing grid should make this distinction clear as that's a huuuuge difference. 

 
Oct 22, 2015
Samotage_300_medium samotage 555 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

@sandeen, I don't think Spotify is a comparative model... they a unicorn have massive funding to do this kind of malarkey... and probably running a negative gross margin (see my earlier post) - plus it's well documented that the actual artists get SFA from these services.

People can live without Spotify - there are many other slippery options...

Sam, @samotage

 
Oct 22, 2015
Samotage_300_medium samotage 555 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

My intentions are to delete the historic raw data, maintaining the aggregated summaries.

There are issues however, like a re-calc needs to not destroy the aggregations that can't be re-aggregated...

Sam, @samotage

 
Oct 22, 2015
Icon_missing_medium kkemp 12 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

Hopefully instead of deleting data you  spend time creating a feature that allows one to set retention periods and roll ups so they can keep their history but at more realistic intervals such as daily or even hourly.  Then there could be a billing model where one paid for data points stored since you keep iterating storage (and your time) is the issue. 

Is there a way to merge streams permanently vs continiung to use calculated streams?

All I ask is that you give us warning and a chance to download our historic data before you start delecting it. 

I'm very hopeful that I will not have to find a more affordable solution that will allow me to keep historic data but if I do I really appreciate all the work you've put into this program as it will set the bar high for switching. 

 
Oct 22, 2015
Samotage_300_medium samotage 555 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

Hi All,

Thanks for your kind comments.  For a long time SEG was supported by our once upon a time Government here in Australia that had energy efficiency programs.  That changed in 2013, when that Abort became prime minsister... Since then I have seen some tough times, a breakdown, divorce from hell amongst other challenges rebuilding my life from scratch.  In that period, SEG has suffered as I've struggled to make ends meet.  Building the billing engine has been a massive job, much harder than I expected, hence the delay - particularly with other events taking forefront.

But, I've kept at it, and thank you for being here.  I have managed to keep going because I don't have investors to placate - SEG is 100% bootstrapped.  I read this this morning and it is spot on.  http://avc.com/2015/10/negative-gross-margins

This is a cricual time for SEG, and it's difficult transitioning from free to paid.  Everyone want's something for nothing or more for less.

Right now, I have relaxed the gates in this transition period and I don't intend to be deleting data any time in the near future.  Besides, this means I need to write more code (which has an implicit cost) to make less money... It doesn't make sense really.

On Data Rates, those reported on the invoices right now are typically a 3 month average updated daily, however there will be an amnesty on this and the data rate calculations when time comes to bill will be based on the rates at billing time.  High data rate people will be notified of this, and very soon I will be implementing the amnetsty and sending notifications.

Data Rates are a statistic, and I hope to have some better statistic charting in the next week or so - this will work for all the stats, max, mins, averages etc.

Sam, @samotage

 
Oct 21, 2015
Icon_missing_medium gdruce 16 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

Hi Sam,

Asside from my question above on data rates, nice work on the invoice.  Nice and clear and easy to see what is driving my bill.

Particulalry helpful to be seeing a draft invoice during the trial period, great idea.

thanks

Glenn

 
Oct 21, 2015
Icon_missing_medium gdruce 16 posts

Topic: SEGmeter / Configuring Data Rates to work with the new pricing plans ?

Hi Sam,

i updated by Data Rate and it's reflecting in the Data Stream screens, but on the draft invoice it still seems to be looking back at my original rate.

Can I check that for billing purposes the data rate is the data rate for the billing period, not the rate when the stream was first established?

ta

Glenn

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